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How's it going with the CSA?

lindsaygii

..

Posted on: October 25, 2009 - 10:28pm
Louise
Parenting specialist DoppleMe

Brilliant idea for a thread!

I really think that the key to it is what you are doing, lindsaygii, keep on their backs.

it would be great to hear peoples' experiences. I know sparkling lime has had a long history with them......

Posted on: October 26, 2009 - 7:52am
Claire-Louise

Well done for this lindsaygii and well done for keeping on their backs!
C-L

Posted on: October 26, 2009 - 6:59pm
lindsaygii

..

Posted on: May 7, 2010 - 6:30pm
Claire-Louise

Well we can't be held responsible for other people's behaviour can we?
C-L

Posted on: October 27, 2009 - 12:30pm
lindsaygii

...

Posted on: May 7, 2010 - 6:31pm
Claire-Louise

Hi Lindsaygii
How frustrating for you to have someone at the end of the phone that is unable or unwilling to answer your questions fully. Roll on the 12th November and I guess you will be contacting them again then to check how things are going? I hope they have agreed to your wishes and will pass it on to the next level if he does not reply in time. Good luck
have a good weekend.
C-L

Posted on: November 6, 2009 - 5:59pm
lindsaygii

...

Posted on: May 7, 2010 - 6:46pm
Louise
Parenting specialist DoppleMe

Good for you, lindsaygii, you do indeed have option 4. I feel that if you are assertive with them that they are more likely to play ball, if only to stop you ringing up :lol: Seriously, it is a disgrace that you have to resort to this! :x

Anyone who wants to know who their MP is can find it here:http://findyourmp.parliament.uk/

Posted on: November 13, 2009 - 8:34am
hazeleyes
DoppleMe

Uhmmm, would an MP be any good to me regarding BT? hahaha

Posted on: November 13, 2009 - 2:51pm
Louise
Parenting specialist DoppleMe

I think that's a good idea, if Trading Standards don't get anywhere and Ofcom won't act because they don't have it in writing.

Posted on: November 13, 2009 - 5:17pm
lindsaygii

We're thinking on the same lines. I rang my MP today. She's a woman called Kerry McCarthy (Labour) and her researchers were very good. I was called back within ten minutes of ringing, and O___ has taken all the details and promised to ring the CSA on my behalf to push the case along.

She could see my point that the CSA are accepting SD is 'compliant' when what he's actually doing is drip-feeding them _just enough_ to stop them taking it to court. In fact, his deadline to get information to them was over a month ago, and all he's actually done is arrange to have a meeting with _someone else_ (his accountant) to talk about it. The MP's office appear to agree that this isn't compliance in any meaningful way, so fingers crossed for their input.

In the meantime I've realised there are million support forums out there for men that want to get out of paying... So unpleasant. And I realised why it is that SD wants to see his accountant - he's going to set up a limited company so he can hide all his income. And if he does do that then I really am going to town on the CSA for giving him time to think of it.

:evil:

Posted on: November 13, 2009 - 8:55pm
Louise
Parenting specialist DoppleMe

You're right, there is even a website which promotes a major (and ridiculous) loophole for those who should pay...and no, I will NOT be mentioning what it is :lol:

Let's hope that the pressure from the MP will work!

Posted on: November 13, 2009 - 9:33pm
hazeleyes
DoppleMe

Good for you going ahead with the MP. I wish I had done all of this when my son was born. Now of course, the father has got away with it because he is in another country, (which suits me just fine, shame it's not further mind you) :lol:
I'm keeping my fingers crossed for you. Though it is hard feeding and clothing babies, it certainly gets a lot harder as they get older!!!

Posted on: November 14, 2009 - 9:36am
Claire-Louise

Hi Lindsaygii
I think you have made a good decision to take it further and your MP is a good way to go. I hope this helps force the situation ahead a bit and it gets sorted sooner rather than later.
Good luck and let us know when you hear back.

Posted on: November 14, 2009 - 5:10pm
leefern

ithought i wld tell u's abt my recent involvment with csa. me and the father split up a year ago it took the csa 3 months even though they had all his details etc on file as we had split up before. now that was fine and although a bit p******d off i could deal with tht, and the fact that the payment wld b 10 pnd a fortnight :lol: as he's not working.

it had been up n running for 4 months when the money failed to appear in my bank, so found out off his mum that his money had been stopped n then started due to an error which is why my payments stopped. fair enough call up csa who appologise say they'l do a manual arrangment until its sorted out wld take a few weeks, also no money wld b back dated as there not allowed to because he doesnt work.

so a few weeks go by now been 5 weeks since av had any money from him, so she says sorry theres a computer error its not been dealt with so explain av already called up etc etc to which i was told sorry computer error. so she tells me shes gonny apply for it again, again will take a few weeks. i ask wht happens if theres a computer error again she cant answer me. at this point i starts gettin angry and saying so when my daughter doesnt have any food it will b ok al jst tell her its a pc error and she'l b fine.

asked if i wld get any money back from wht he should have been paying and was told when he gets a job. she obv doesnt knw my ex job is a badword :lol: so i asked hypothetically if he never got a job wht wld happen. if he never got a job i wld still be gettin child maintenance till shes abt 20 till he pays off his arears which i actually find quite amusing, a mean sorry but i think am gonny need it more when shes five than when shes 20! it aint a great deal of money but every penny i have spare goes on my daughter so i think paying wht he's supposed to aint askin for 2 much goes towards a new pair of shoes or something.

anyway am still waiting and ive got a feeling am gonny be for a while.............

Posted on: November 17, 2009 - 5:51pm
Claire-Louise

Hi Leefern
Thanks for your post and I really feel for you and the hassle you have had to go through and keep chasing up with pretty silly excuses as to why it has not been sorted. it must be very frustrating for you as it takes up enough of our time looking after our children that we hardly have time to catch up anyway, let alone having to hassle other people to do their jobs properly!
I hope it does get sorted and you start to get the money you are entitled to through again - keep pestering them and keep strong.
C-L

Posted on: November 17, 2009 - 6:31pm
lindsaygii

leefern - have they told you when you're going to get all those arrears? I asked them how mine is supposed to pay off all the money he owes already, and that was ANOTHER question they didn't have an answer for....

It's pathetic, isn't it? :evil:

Posted on: November 17, 2009 - 10:23pm
Bubblegum
DoppleMe

I get £5 a week and that INCLUDES paying back three hundred odd quid in arrears : )

In all reality when it comes to small amounts like that I don't think it benefits anyone.

Posted on: November 18, 2009 - 9:14am
hazeleyes
DoppleMe

Hi Leefern
The whole situation is ridiculous isn't it? I actually think Bubblegum is right about the piddling amount not worth the hassle, but then again, every little bit helps right.
My son's half sister's Mum was receiving some money for only 3 months, then the 'sperm doner' disappeared out of the country. He owes her £4000, and she knows she will never see it. I can't do anything about money now because he is out of the country. The CSA did tell me that if he came to England, and I knew when, I could then have him arrested and his passport taken from him.
Now, this sounds very vindictive, but I would do it :lol: :lol: The Mum to his daughter would rather the Spanish authorities got involved, as she says, their prisons are far worse than ours :lol:
Personally, I would love to see him castrated!
In time it is he that is going to be the loser. One day he will be old, and (hopefully)need looking after, and I shall be there to spit in his face.

Posted on: November 18, 2009 - 12:59pm
Bubblegum
DoppleMe

alisoncam wrote:
I would love to see him castrated!

I suggest you watch the film Hard Candy.

Posted on: November 18, 2009 - 1:05pm
Louise
Parenting specialist DoppleMe

CSA arrears are suposed to be included in the assessment, however if the parent without majority care has an income below a certain level then there is a ceiling (£5 a week in some cases!) So when you get the assessment, lindsaygii, (2011?) in theory it will spell that out.

I agree that there are few things more annoying or frustrating than a parent who doesn't contribute or seem to be interested :evil:

Posted on: November 19, 2009 - 10:06am
sparklinglime
DoppleMe

Louise wrote:
I agree that there are few things more annoying or frustrating than a parent who doesn't contribute or seem to be interested :evil:

There isn't? 8-) :shock: :? :roll: :twisted: :D

Posted on: November 19, 2009 - 12:50pm
Louise
Parenting specialist DoppleMe

....well actually I can't think of ANY!

Posted on: November 19, 2009 - 1:16pm
leefern

lindsaygii they said the only way il get the arrears is if he ever gets a job (not likely) or he will keep paying maintenance after she has passed the age he's supposed so she could be 20 and al still be gettin my standard 5er a week :lol: :lol:

castration sounds like such a good idea alisoncam maybe we could start up a group :twisted: :lol:

ye every little helps every fortnight me and the wee yin splash out on a chinese with the 10 pound and it tastes even better knowing he paid for it :lol: thats jst nasty aint it ....... oh well :roll:

Posted on: November 20, 2009 - 12:53pm
Claire-Louise

Leefern
I just see you now, enjoying every mouthful, relishing every chew!!!
C-L

Posted on: November 20, 2009 - 6:23pm
Anonymous

http://recession.onespace.org.uk/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=46&Itemid=57

Lindsay If you would like to chat about this please contact me via the above link. I have been giving free CSA advice since 1993 and I work for the charity delivering the 1 to 1 advice for one space. Keep smiling Jean

Posted on: November 26, 2009 - 3:32pm
lindsaygii

Thanks Jean, I am seeing a lawyer for a free half hour next week, and I'll get back to you, too. :)

The update is they assessed him for £5 a week because after his meeting with his accountant - he was able to tell them he lives on just £10 a week. And they swallowed it...

I actually heard this from the MP's office, who said that it was being investigated further. But when I rang my Caseworker, she said that was that. Sooo, I pointed out that I'd been told of the further investigation.

Anyway, she wants ME to provide further information. Right, cos I'm a single parent living on benefits in Bristol with a five month old baby, he's in Glasgow, and she's at work for a government agency with access to all sorts of powers, databases and so on. So *I'm* the one that should be doing the investigation...

Re the arrears. Caseworker told me she'd said he had to pay it off immediately, but her manager decided to give him three months. Thanks, manager, for that. He was apparently asking for a year. To pay £75!!!

In the meantime, I bought baby boy a small toy from Tesco today. £8. I'm not grudging it - he loves it, I love him, everyone's happy. I'm just saying - £8, £5.

And something else that occured to me.. because he's on Working Tax Credit he has his contribution to our child capped at £5. But strangely, even though I'm on benefits, no-one is capping MY contribution.

Sigh.

Posted on: November 27, 2009 - 9:45pm
Bubblegum
DoppleMe

The CSA is the result of a vote grabbing agenda gone wrong.. just like most everything else our governments push around at election times it really has no grounding in reality beyond a few surveys and a database in excel.

Posted on: November 27, 2009 - 10:42pm
Louise
Parenting specialist DoppleMe

That's ridiculous, lindsaygii. The "philosophy" (I use the term loosely! ;) ) behind the system is that no-one, whether a Parent With Care on benefits or Non-resident Parent should have less than "X" amount to live on. I have seen lots of parents (mainly dads) living in total penury after the payment of their child maintenance, yet on the other hand, poeple like your boys' dad appear to be in a VERY much better position! :x

Posted on: November 28, 2009 - 9:11am
Claire-Louise

Hi Lindsaygii
I hope it goes well with the lawyer and that you mange to sort out some stuff to your satisfaction. It doesn 't seem right at all with all this government agenda for the Early Years 0-5 years being the most formative in a childs life and yet expecting parents in situations like yours to be scraping around. Have you looked at the money survival kit on this site? Do you know anyone with older children who might be into passing on clothes, equipment etc that their children have outgrown? I continually do swaps of this kind amoungst the people I know as it can really help, especially when they are so young and growing so quick and won't remember it when they are older and hold it against us in any way!
Have a nice weekend.
C-L

Posted on: November 28, 2009 - 7:43pm
lindsaygii

I'm lucky on that one - I've been given *tons* of stuff. It just makes me mad that they are prepared to accept something which is such obvious bullsh*t. How is he keeping an accountant if he's earning £10 a week? He isn't. So he's lying about either the money, or the accountant. Since the accountant faxed information from his office machine, that only leaves one option...

Ah well. Next chapter Tuesday-ish.

Posted on: November 28, 2009 - 11:23pm
Claire-Louise

Hiya Lindsaygii, Yes it must be very frustrating to be able to read between the lines and see what is really going on. Good that you have been given tons of stuff. It is good if you can keep getting bits and bobs from people as he grows up cos people tend to give lots of stuu at the baby stage and then it can dwindle away a bit.
Good luck on Tuesday and if you get don all the answers you are looking for then come back to Jean on this site as I think she will be very useful.
Hope you had a good weekend?
Cheers C-L

Posted on: November 29, 2009 - 5:38pm
Anonymous

Hi lindaygii
Cant wait for a conversation with you because there are so many things that could be looked at.
Have they seen his tax return for the relevant time period? Have you asked the CSA if there are any expenses which might be considered "not reasonable or not wholly connected with the business"?. (eg any private use of a car? telephone? etc). Is he a director of the business? Is he a shareholder?
Did you ask them to carry out a revision at the time? If so have they done one and have you had a refusal to revise?
How long is it since the last assessment?
Have you considered asking for a new assessment because then you have the right of appeal if you are not happy with result? You can appeal any new decision and you get to see how the csa have calculated income and if you go to tribunal they can estimate his earnings if appropriate.
Have you any idea of his lifestyle and have you considered a variation/departure? You may not know his housing costs/council tax but clearly £10 income won't cover it. There are ways to estimate levels of income and what a household's basic needs are, so you can make a case and if the csa don't accept your application/reasons then you can appeal and ask the tribunal to consider lifestyle inconsistent with income.
You mention working tax credit - if he is only earning £10 then is it likely he is working 16 hours? If the answer is yes then truthfully he ought to consider giving up the business because he could earn more in McDonalds. Has he a partner? Is she working? Is she supporting him? Whose name is the WTC claim in? If he is the chief wage earner, then the WTC is added to his income. Loads of questions, lots of possible ways forward. Wait to hear from you via the 1 to 1 confidential advice service on the site.

Posted on: November 30, 2009 - 4:33pm
lindsaygii

Hey all. Well, I'm exhausted, frankly, by all this... :(

I can't bear to detail all the calls I had with them today, but I ended up speaking to the Service Resolution Manager, who has the ability to string a sentence together, listen to what's said all the way to the end before replying, and not bang on ceaselessly about the SD's rights. So all in all, an improvement on his staff.

He has offered to send someone (possibly two someones) round to see me. They have what they call a 'Face to Face Officer'. I kid you not.

This is, of course, because I told him that I'm sick to death of being given the runaround by his teams, none of whom seem to have even heard of the hymnsheet or ducks, never mind got the same one, or put any in a row.

I also told him I'd got my MP on it and had consulted with a lawyer.

By the end of all this (four calls yesterday, three today), I'm still not going to get more than a fiver.

Jean, I don't know how to summarise all this in the online form, so I'm just going to write you a request very baldly, and see how we go. I hear great things about you, so fingers crossed!

[glum]

Posted on: December 2, 2009 - 10:05pm
Louise
Parenting specialist DoppleMe

Lindsaygii, I salute you! :P What a saga of long-winded hassle and difficulty this has been for you and WELL DONE for persisting and I hope so much that Scoop Aid will be able to get you a good result.

Posted on: December 3, 2009 - 8:39am
sparklinglime
DoppleMe

I'm taking the matter I have to the MP too - or at least I will when I have time! :roll:

The Git works full-time, but has told CSA he works 12 hours a week - which he does with one employer, PLUS loads of overtime. He's also a bank nurse (auxillary) with the NHS. I've asked a few times now for an attachment of earnings to be put on his wage. I can only assume the nursing home where he does the overtime pays him in cash.

He should pay just under £53 a month for the children, but is forever in arrears. I was probably ok about things until he gets married in the USA last year and then holidays in Greece this year. He also pleads poverty to the children if they ask for things. He has told the youngest he doesn't have to pay for things as he doesn't live with us.

On one hand, I don't want anything off him. Him moving to the USA was a dream for a while, but I figure he's too old now at 49. Yet the thing that gets me is the fact he lies. If he was a responsible father, he could lie as much as he wants :D But he's a Git...

I think on CSA the idea on paper is absolutely brilliant. In reality though, I think if people choose to lie about their income, and hide it well, (don't forget there are mother's who are the NRPs and lie) I don't really see what any body - official or otherwise - can do to change that.

As I say to people. I married badly. Clearly the 'Jones' gene must be pretty strong though, as the children do seem to be 'quite' pleasant 8-)

Posted on: December 3, 2009 - 10:01am
Louise
Parenting specialist DoppleMe

Hello sparkling lime,

That £53 a month sounds very low. I know you lose most of it from your Income Support but it is the principle here! The more MPs put pressure on the agency, the more likely it is to be reformed. I know that the new Child Maintenance Options scheme is excellent, but it does rely on parents co-operating together.

I hear a lot of stories of non-paying parents (both men and women, as you say) and I also hear of parents who have the kids almost half the time yet not only do they not receive any of the Child Tax Credit/Child Benefit, they also pay child support and half of everything like nursery fees and end up in poverty themselves. I know that one system will NOT fit all but surely we could have a better way of enforcing fair payments from reluctant payers (soap box now :x )

Posted on: December 3, 2009 - 12:52pm
sparklinglime
DoppleMe

There must be a way of sorting this out, really.

As you say it is the principal. If you felt that things were at least sort of fair, you lose some anger.

This month there's been £22 payment from the CSA. £6 per child for a month.

He could actually turn me to violence, and I don't actually consider myself to be a violent person.

(I could be wrong there, of course)

Posted on: December 3, 2009 - 3:04pm
Anonymous

by sparklinglime on Thu Dec 03, 2009 9:01 am

Hi I always advise my clients to save MPs till all other avenues are exhausted or if the delay has gone on too long.

Re the hours that the Git (NRP) works - have you told the CSA that he has more than one employer? If he works overtime have you asked them to call the employer for an average earnings figure? As a bank nurse, is he employed or self employed? He is unlikely to be fiddling with the NHS as an employer so have the CSA investigated earnings from this employer? They can issue a CSA 720 to the HMRC asking for details of earnings for him although this could take some time. Is the nursing home a private one? The onus of proof unfortunately lies with you to proove he is being paid cash in hand but it is illegal to pay cash in hand as they are evading national insurance and income tax so the HMRC might be interested and investigate.

Re the attachment of earnings - is he not paying regularly? If not, you can request a DEO (deduction from earnings) and the CSA are usually quite good at this if there is a history of defaulting payment.

"He should pay just under £53 a month for the children, but is forever in arrears". If you are on Income Support You are entitled to a child support premium of up to £10 per week but only from 27.10.08 so if the arrears are from before this date, it is money which is owed to the government and I would leave them to sort it ;if the arrears are accrued after that date then some of it might be yours. The CSA should be setting up an arrears agreement with the NRP and usually they expect the arrears to be repaid within 2 years.

If you want specific advice then contact me via the one to one confidential advice service on the One Space website.

Posted on: December 3, 2009 - 5:36pm
lindsaygii

To be honest I'm as angry with them as I am with the amount he has to pay.

I am sick to death of hearing about the father's rights. Not one single person there ever mentions the baby's rights.

I am sick to death of them telling me different information every time I call.

I am sick to death of them claiming to be 'investigating' then doing nothing. And even criticising me for calling them an investigative agency whenit suits them to say they are not.

I am sick to death of being bloody patronised by them.

Basically, I wish I hadn't bothered. The money is s**t and the principle is a joke. It's just misery and stress that I don't need.

Anyway. I'm seeing MP next week and talking to Scoop tomorrow.

Posted on: December 3, 2009 - 5:58pm
Louise
Parenting specialist DoppleMe

I understand that you wish you hadn't bothered. But I for one am so glad that you have. SOMEONE has got to stand up to them! I know you would rather it wasn't you. :(

Posted on: December 3, 2009 - 6:41pm
Claire-Louise

Hi Lindsaygii and Sparklinglime.
I applaud both of you for making the effort to follow this up and see it through. I understand the frustration and stress involved and the feeling of 'why do I bother?' But I think it is a really important issue and the more people that do keep hassling and involve as many people as they can, the more likely it is to bring about change. So well done you! Keep us posted - we are all backing you.
Cheers C-L

Posted on: December 4, 2009 - 6:11pm
lindsaygii

Well, there's no update, because after his promise to call me with an appointment to see a Face to Face Officer to sort out my complaint, which he made early on Wednesday afternoon, the Senior Resolution Officer has not bothered to call me back.

What these people don't seem to realise is, they get to knock off work and go home to their life after s**tting on us from a great height all day.

But they are our life.

If they do come to my house they better bring a large box of Very Very Sorry with them or there'll be hell.

Posted on: December 4, 2009 - 9:28pm
hazeleyes
DoppleMe

Hi lindsay
Sorry to hear you are going through a bad time with the CSA. Have to hand it to you, you are great for sticking with it, and going further etc. Good on you. I wish you well.
Take care
Alison
x :)

Posted on: December 4, 2009 - 10:52pm
Claire-Louise

Hi Lindsaygii
And so the frustration lingers on and on and on - poor you but stick with it as you have got this far, it is really worth seeing it through.
Good luck
C-L

Posted on: December 5, 2009 - 9:01pm
Anna
Parenting specialist DoppleMe

Hi Lindsaygii

How did it go with ScoopAid??

Posted on: December 7, 2009 - 11:07am
lindsaygii

I talked to Jean at ScoopAid today. She clearly knows her stuff and was very informative.. However, in my case it doesn't sound like I'll be able to do anything beyond causing trouble.

The plan is to lodge an appeal with them (has to be done within 28 days of their last assessment) and at the same time get the MP to request extra information. Then see what comes out of it all.

Ultimately it looks like I won't get any extra money.

More annoyingly, it doesn't sound as though I am likely to get an apology for the way I've been treated. However, Jean (lovely and clever as she sounds) doesn't know how bloody-minded I can be! You're looking at the woman who got an apology from the Area Manager of the entire dole office dealing with East London not many months ago. Cost me dear in grey hairs and stress hormones, but I got it! ha hahaaa

So, I'm going to follow her plan, and at the same time I'm going to follow my plan. And in the meantime, I have set up a blog. No, really. You know what, if I have to document every single bloody word they say to me and make them all public, I'll do it, if it makes them stop treating me like a bit of dirt on their shoe and show me some common decency.

Hnh.

So far the blog is just a half-assed version of this thread, but I'm working on it. :)

Posted on: December 8, 2009 - 12:47am
Louise
Parenting specialist DoppleMe

I would love to read your blog, lindsaygii. I do take my hat off to you; you're a woman after my own heart!

Posted on: December 8, 2009 - 8:25am
Bubblegum
DoppleMe

I'd like to read your blog too :)

I keep one too, not as much now as I used to, it kind of comes in waves. Sometimes my entries come from something I have started in a thread somewhere in a forum.

later.

Posted on: December 8, 2009 - 8:38am
Louise
Parenting specialist DoppleMe

Do you get lots of people reading your blog Bubblegum? and do you advertise it to anyone?

Posted on: December 8, 2009 - 11:27am